Macross Frontier 19, School Days 06
August 18th, 2008 by Shirukii
Uso da…
Ugh, I hate when built up relationships are reset to square one thanks to some stupid misunderstanding like this. It wasn’t dramatic when School Rumble did it god knows how many times, and it’s not dramatic here! It’s just a half assed plot device to drag out the relationship dorama where it would have otherwise been more or less resolved. FFFFFFFFFFFFFFF…
You know the drill, another Macross Frontier post, another seemingly futile attempt at reasoning with the Sheryl shippers. Hey, I’ll stop doing them once you guys start admitting that she has no more character depth than the kiddy end of your local community centre swimming pool.
Here’s the thing, Sheryl is your typical supersillious badass female lead, the kind you see in Hollywood action movies, reacting to male advances and genuine concern with coldness and violence. While this was interesting for, oh, maybe the first five minutes, it just got old after that. Having the same stock reaction to every single interaction from a cordial hospital visit from Alto to the news of her death does not depict a woman who does not compromise on her pride, it’s just plain poor characterization. Yes there were isolated incidences like that date episode or that time Alto returned her earring where she displayed vaguely human emotions, but in the grand scheme of things, she’s as stock and predictable as many other of the characters on the show.
Considering the events of late is all the proof you need that she doesn’t exhibit any vaguely humanistic traits. She was told that she’s dying and refuses to accept the help of those around her, not because she’s in denial or anger stages of DABDA, but because of a foolish sense of pride. Real people do not act like this, real people go through DABDA, because it’s the psychological response to grief.
Preemptive rebuttal: yes, Sheryl is a superstar and thus has a lot of pride, she’s a human being before that and thus shouldn’t be impervious to the psychology that affects the rest of us. No, you cannot excuse this by saying that Sheryl is an anime character and not a real person, because then you have to concede that she lacks depth.
Also, I post this knowing full well what probably happened in that last scene, where Sheryl did go to Alto for comfort and help. Yes, that means that she will finally have attained some level of depth and characterization past that of the aforementioned supersillious badass female lead stereotype. No, that does not nullify everything I’ve said up to this point, it just means the ice queen has melted.
On that note…
I pretty much said my piece about this scene in my opening paragraph, it was stupid for them to have thrown it in. Things were going well between Alto and Ranka, and Alto and Sheryl had just had a touching moment where Sheryl finally opened up to him. There’s no reason why Alto couldn’t have had time to think things over and come to a decision on his own, instead they chose to stage this grand misunderstanding that will send Ranka, Sheryl and Alto into the depths of angst for the better part of the remainder of the series.
The above is made especially true by the scene that preceded it, Mikhail has a blunt conversation with Alto, making it absolutely clear that he has two girls vying for his heart and he has to act or lose both of them to indecisiveness. Alto realized this and was going to make a decision anyway, why was it necessary to force his hand and up his angst by making him look like a two timer?! The only thing that came out of this scene was the furthering of Mikhail’s place as a voice of reason and a really good friend.
And what a great friend he is, even offering a reassuring nod to Luca, reminding him that they’re all friends, that they’ve been together this whole time and that everything will be just fine as long as it stays that way. How Mikhail came to be in tune with Luca’s nervousness of late as he had to deal with the L.A.I. and pressuring from Leon is beyond me, or at least beyond the scope of what the anime has shown us.
Now if only he’d take the sweet sweet loli bait that dangles in front of his face, he’d be my hero.
Wonder what Leon’s grand scheme is anyway. The guy seems really shallow and power hungry, he probably just wants to climb the ranks as high as he can and reap the financial rewards. From the looks of it, he set up the assassination of Frontier’s president and will announce his planet eater bombs as a countermeasure against the Vajra to skyrocket his popularity in the public eye, assuring his succession to presidency. I still surmise that he’s just Grace’s pawn though, and that she’s the real final boss of this series, she’s just so evil, she can’t be a lackey!
Finally, as expected, confirmation that Ai-kun is indeed a baby Vajra.
Weekly crybaby Ranka shot
~ Shirukii ~
23 Responses to “Macross Frontier 19, School Days 06”
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> It’s just a half assed plot device to drag out the relationship dorama where it would have otherwise been more or less resolved.
It’s certainly not a half assed plot device. Rather, it’s a necessary crisis action that Ranka must take in order to push her character off the cliff, so to speak.
Remember back at the Macross-zero episode where Ranka was uncertain rather or not to accept the role of Mao? Not until she caught sight of Sheryl doing her tease-and-kiss on Alto did she summon up enough determination to step above her hesitation.
Back to this episode, Ranka, with the Vajra about to declare total war on Frontier, is about to make another tough decision that will require this episode’s scandalous ending to catalyze. She is about to ascend the throne of Queen of the Vajra.
> … she [Sheryl] has no more character depth than the kiddy end of your local community centre swimming pool.
That kiddy end of the pool has enough water to drown you. :p
> Preemptive rebuttal: yes, …
You don’t need to be defensive. Just state your points and let the flame … err … I mean discussion ensues. That’s what keeps me reading your posts. :)
Now let me say why you’re so wrong. :) About that DABDA thing, I had thought she did go through all the stages.
Denial: Ranka’s rise had been happening way before just the past two episodes. Sheryl had to see it with her own eyes on the Bridge of Quarters to believe that she had been displaced.
Anger: I thought I saw a lot of heat sieving through her ice-surface during her conversation with Alto.
Bargaining: Sheryl Nome does not bargain. Bargaining means procuring favors from other people, and Sheryl does not, in her mind, need favors from lesser humans. This is not a lack of character on her part; on the contrary, it is one of her defining characterization.
Depression: The fact that she had to declare that she was in tip-top shape is proof enough that she was not in tip-top shape.
Acceptance: You said it yourself, Sheryl did go to Alto for comfort and help.
Well, that’s my 2 cents. I hope I’m not appearing strident. Am I now banned from any hope of becoming a guest writer on your blog? :)
Well I disagree with everything you had to say about Sheryl, just because we are human doesn’t mean we all will respond the same way to everything. Having lived so long surely even you have by now realized that not all humans are sane and that one person responds differently to another. That being said I am more than certain that my thought processes are radically different from yours, since I doubt liberal application of firepower and violent execution are part of your plans to over come daily problems. ;)
I don’t think RankaxAlto-hime is going well at all the gulf between them only widened after Galia 4 and now Ranka is asking Brera for advice and taking him out for soft cream on a starlight dayto without Alto-hime. This development annoys me since it seems that Ranka is again relying on others to pusher forward, I don’t think Ranka can win over Alto-hime if she needs Brera to be there to hold her hand.
While you blast Sheryl for being shallow at least she has gone from haughty bitch to troubled young woman. Her bravado and pride are but a pale shadow of what they once were, and I am sure she was going to confront Alto-hime once and for all. We shall see what the three will do, but right now Brera has shut Alto-hime down repeatedly and Yasaburo forced Alto-hime to return home if only to see Sheryl. That in itself just shows how much Alto-hime cared. While Ranka had to call hime to climb up her window, Alto-hime crawled through the dirty and hedgerow on some vague statement by Mikhail. Ranka is suffering from one step forward two steps back. When things looked girm Ranka sought out Brera and Ai-kun both of whom will provide more trouble than help.
Up until now Ranka seemed more than willing to dally with Brera and comply with Grace’s demands than court Alto-hime. Her relationship with hime had hit a wall and was stagnating and perhaps regressing in some areas. Hopefully now that Ranka has seen Sheryl and Alto-hime together again she will get serious she will probably stumble but if Ranka stays in Brera’s arms then all might well be lost.
Sheryl might be trying to hold on to her failing pride, but she has guts and guts is enough. Adversity at least has forced Sheryl to change her ways even if slightly in your view. Ranka has greatly disappointed me in her starlight dayto with Brera, it is inexcusable at this stage if Ranka was indeed serious. Sheryl at least bothered to learn about hime and his family, his interests, and his past. Ranka probably doesn’t know any where near as much. Sheryl is aiming to court hime, Ranka was seeking to be courted by and is failing to be courted by hime. Even if you only have nasty words for Sheryl things on the love front for Ranka look noticeably grimmer. If Ranka is to break the curse of Minmay then she better ditch the anchors known as Grace and Brera otherwise she will have to work extra hard towards the finish.
Yes I am quite bitter that Ranka would go on a starlight dayto with anyone other than Alto-hime. Once again Brera beats Alto-hime only this time it wasn’t about dogfighting.
>It’s just a half assed plot device to drag out the relationship dorama where it would have otherwise been more or less resolved.
Except that it WASN’T resolved at all. Alto never chose between Ranka and Sheryl. In fact, he was so dumb that he didn’t even acknowledge their feelings for him until this episode, when Mikhail pointed it out.
You may hate Sheryl but you have to admit that she was always professional in her work, while Ranka ditched an important parade to search for her vajra pet and waste some time with Brera-nii.
Ranka seems more self-centered in her feelings. When she talks with Alto, she is always speaking of herself. She never tried to understand Alto’s situation.
Sheryl is not shallow. Her tsundere attitude is only a facade to mask her loneliness and fear. She tried to push Alto away because she thinks that she has little left to live. Fortunately Klan was there to make her realize her true feeelings.
>How Mikhail came to be in tune with Luca’s nervousness of late as he had to deal with the L.A.I. and pressuring from Leon is beyond me
Last episode, during his date with Klan, Mikhail saw Luca accompanied by two MiBs. They work together so he had plenty of time to notice the discomfort on Luca’s face. He doesn’t know what Luca is hiding but it’s easy to see that he is troubled.
LOL it seems like one of your line has been strike a little hard this time, Shirukii.
I guess you might have come to a conclusion that one of them between Ranka and Sheryl might be died by the end of the series. If this were true, would you gave me your answer?
>Hey, I’ll stop doing them once you guys start admitting that she has no more character depth than the kiddy end of your local community centre swimming pool.
Nope. Sorry love. :3 I find Sheryl more appealing and interesting than Ranka. I honestly will never admit Ranka to be any better as a character than Sheryl so you’re free to keep ‘em coming. The only way she appeals to me is watching Sheryl and her together in the OP. Their voices together are sublime. ^-^
>She was told that she’s dying and refuses to accept the help of those around her, not because she’s in denial or anger stages of DABDA, but because of a foolish sense of pride. Real people do not act like this, real people go through DABDA, because it’s the psychological response to grief.
Yeah. I gotta disagree with that.
Bakaneko said a few relevant things already but I’ll add in an additional 2 cents and risk the flames. I remember taking a course on death a few semesters back (really difficult stuff too, still don’t want to recall things I ended up sharing) so I can recall a thing or two that were empahsized about dying. No two people address the same stressful situation in exactly the same way and there are two reasons for this. Different people have their own sets of skills and, of those skills, they are better at using certain ones at certain times. Also, each person perceives the same situation uniquely. Therefore, a person’s reaction to extreme stress must be considered according to what he/she is actually doing or thinking. You can’t judge someone based on what that person might do, should do, or usually does; or on what people generally do in similar situations. Coping with a highly stressful event like impending death is an individualistic effort.
Sheryl’s in a very vulnerable position. The great Sheryl Nome has suffered quite a fall – Ranka has surpassed her in singing, her manager left her with grim revelations – I can only wonder what one expects her to do? What would one expect of a girl that prides herself on the grounds that she built herself from the ground up in sucess when it was revealed it was never the case? I thought the way she’s reacting is her individual way of coping. If that’s not humanistic enough…
She did cry, I’m sure she does feel overwhelmed by what is coming. However front of Alto it seems she didn’t want to seem so weak or scared so she probably minimized the problem in her mind. Hopefully she really did go to Alto and tell him what’s going on at the end just before Ranka showed up. I could take that as acceptance. Now I have to wait before finding out what’s gonna happen next. I’m waiting for Sheryl to make her comeback.
Okay, I think I wrote enough. Done! ^-^;;
Haha oh jeez Shirukii… The Sheryl fanbase is taking over!
I’ll say my 2 cents at the last episode. I’ll be charging mah lazors until then.
Ranka has made a turn back to her original character. When she first appeared in the series; she was an immature girl. One would expect her to develop as a static character. But in this episode, the superstar Ranka ditched the parade which was meant for her, where thousands of people waited for her… Just to find her baby Vajra Ai-kun. THEN forgets to do so half way to have fun with her brother. Irresponsible and unprofessional.
Her mental dependence on Alto is confirmed as well as her naive thinking. ( I mean come on… How does a pre-coordinated arrow through the art translate into Alto’s feelings for her? Delusional…)
I would rather hear Sheryl and Alto’s conversation together than listening to Ranka’s cries of ” Alto-kun! Alto-Kun! Alto-Kun!”
Her character, in my opinion, is the boring one.
alsdfhkjlaskjdflsadfjalsfjlakf WHAAAARGARBLGARBLGARBL
*deep breath*
I haven’t read all the comments in detail yet, but there is one thing that you are ALL mistaking in my arguments. I’m not calling Ranka a deep character! She’s a green haired genki loli, there, I put her into a single anime archetype, that’s it, that’s all. What I’m trying to argue is that Sheryl is just as easily stereotyped!
Nowhere am I saying that Ranka has better characterization, just that Sheryl isn’t much better.
Detailed individual responses later…if I have time D=
“What I’m trying to argue is that Sheryl is just as easily stereotyped!”
Except not. I think your post is slightly misunderstood, but Sheryl doesn’t fit into any stereotypes. Calling her tsundere robs her of the onee-sama part of her. Calling her selfish robs her of her kindness. Calling her uncontrollable and wild robs her of her sharp insight. Ranka fits, but put Sheryl into say, Louise from ZnT or other tsundere-type series and you’ll end up with very, very different series, if not for the better. Sheryl is the kind of woman who will easily laugh at the stupidity of the situation and take control of the series instead of the series taking control of her. That is the strong part of Sheryl.
I’m trying to trace DABDA through your posts. I’m rooting for you to reach acceptance by the end of the series. ;)
If you ever want to seriously discuss psychology, the very first thing that you need to do is to recognize how meager our understanding really is. Theories are like little windows into a dark room, but no single one of them on their own can always shed light on what you’re looking for. To assert that humans “must” behave in accordance with any theory is simply arrogant.
That out of the way, the weakness in your arguments is that you’re all over the map. You start out by claiming that Sheryl is shallow, but your points are aimed at proving that she doesn’t act like a real person “ought” to. These are two unrelated issues. A character who is shallow acts based on a simple set of traits. But your points are aimed at proving that those traits are unrealistic, not that she’s a simplistic character.
Once again, let me throw this at you: There are no shallow characters; only shallow interpretations.
I simply wonder if you’ve reached the stage where it’s just easier to try to drag Sheryl down to Ranka’s level, than it is to elevate Ranka to Sheryl’s.
@Shirukii
I don’t think we’re targetting you for thinking that Ranka is a deep character.
We’re just discussing our opinions, and thinking in the objective.
Take it easy! :D
My comment disappeared… Anyway I basically said that I think you are mistaking depth for growth, and the writers have made Sheryl a somewhat complex character. And I think you are attributing your own reasoning to how she is feeling in regards to her sickness. I believe you are purposely pigeon-holing Sheryl because you want her to be as one-trick-pony as Ranka is.
This does not mesh with how Sheryl was before and how she acts now. Sheryl has been changed by her loss, and her experiences have shown her capable of a variety of emotions and actions. This isn’t to say that Ranka is better or worse than Sheryl, but your criticism of Sheryl is definitely unfair.
I agree with you wholeheartedly…In fact I will now visit you.
I don’t have time to properly respond
I did a character assessment of All three. Suffice it to say. Sheryl fans were not happy with me pointing out her character flaws.
link for Sheryl.
http://forums.bleachboard.com/showpost.php?p=38728&postcount=2
I would be honored if you’d take a look at it and post your thoughts.
Ranka Lee…(I did her some justice)
http://forums.animesuki.com/showthread.php?p=1740911#post1740911
Alto the emasculated male (The reason he won’t pick Sheryl)
http://forums.bleachboard.com/showpost.php?p=38727&postcount=1
@BleachOD
Granted you have focused on many possible flaws in Sheryl you are neglecting one important factor, Kawamori, and he is not your typical director of moe moe love stories, he doesn’t even do moe moe love stories. The man is a master troll who has proven that he is capable of and is more than willing to throw curve balls like the pineapple cake incident. Judging by his past work in SDF Macross just because Sheryl is flawed doesn’t mean she is out of the run with a 20% chance of victory. Misa and Hikaru got together because by that time Minmay was hardly involving herself in Hikaru’s life and went about dallying with her protector Kaifun, the predecessor of Brera. Misa was jealous Minmay and Hikaru disrespected Misa from day one and she had little respect for him. They ended up together because they got to know each other and despite the disagreements they fell in love over time.
Right now it can go either way and despite Sheryl’s character flaws Ranka is running dangerously low on interaction time with Alto-hime. Just be cause Sheryl emasculates Alto-hime doesn’t mean they can’t be together. Hikaru from SDF Macross was a chauvinist prick who believed women shouldn’t be commanding anything and that they belonged in the Kitchen where they could look cute. His ideal girl was Minmay, but he ended up with Misa who kept her job and her rank. Minmay was in love with Hikaru in the end, but by then he had moved on, and Minmay only realized just what she had given up after the fame, the fans, and the money was gone.
The only thing we can be sure of is that it’s not over until Kawamori says its over. Despite the fact that Misa and Minmay characteristics have been split between the two, Ranka so far has made the most Minmay moves of the two, whether or not this will hurt her in the end remains to be seen, but right now Ranka is going to have more trouble interacting with Alto-hime to get that 80% chance of victory that you claim she has.
I didn’t finish it. I got banned at suki because Sheryl fans couldn’t accept what I said. “The comparison has meaning as well as TRUE meaning” It should be obvious he is doing a “What if?” What if Minmei won?
Except to make it work…Alto had to be emasculated. Sheryl emasculating. Besides based on their behaviors. It’s a no brainer…
@BleachOD -
Yeah, but if Sheryl ‘wins’ it would be a “what if…” Minmay ‘won’ DYRL… conversely if Ranka wins it would be more like a “what if…” Minmay ‘won’ SDFM
You should come to IRC if you get a chance… #macrossuki @ Rizon… people have been clamoring for the “Orihime of the Macross fandom” to stop crying and running away. ;P
Plus we’ve been waiting for your follow up to our rebuttals @AS… Episodes have passed! We need updates!
I’m sorry, I still don’t understand one thing: pineapple cake?
^-^;;
@BleachOD
With Kawamori it is dangerous to make bold assertions such as yours, not long ago we were all sure that Ozma would die, Ozma not only lived Kawamori rubbed it in for good measure. The only ones who are privvy to the ending are Kawamori and his team, thus nothing is obvious to the audience.
Nevertheless we shall see if your assertions are true, Kawamori however is anything but obvious.
@Kari
Pineapples were once the bane of pilots, the original Skull 1 died waiting for his girl friend to make him a pineapple salad. However when Kawamori was waving teh death flag for Ozma there was plenty of pineapple cake. So much so that not only did Ozma live he even ate some to end the myth that pineapples kill in Macross.
I am actually thinking about crushing both IchiOri and Those Nome-ers. If you go by Alto’s behavior. You will see it’s a no brainer. So you might get your wish.
I pissed off a Mod…I am tired of being banned. It’s unusual for one with a rep as high as mine. You really don’t want me to finish it…
I didn’t think Ozma would die. Why did you?
Hey,
Just wanted to let you guy Know my new Macross Fansite: http://watchmacross.blogspot.com You can watch the latest Macross Frontier Episode as well as the older ones!
PS Also looking for staff for the site let me know if your interested!
@BleachOD
You must be new to Macorss or at least only familiar with DYRL, They were laying on the Roy references pretty thick in pineapple cake episode, The Pineapple Salad has been the mythical slayer of aces since SDF Macross. If you have never seen it you probably won’t know it very well and the maintence guy starring into the cockpit of Skull 1 with shock reference you have been lost on a new comer like yourself. Old Macross Vets however saw all the references.
I don’t think a Ranka end is a no brainer, but it is mostly because I think Kawamori is slightly crazy and therefore unpredictable with a mind all his own.
MF 20!
The dead sniper flag has been raised.
I can’t wait to see it! And yet I do not want to… :(
it’s a no brainer. You people are in serious denial and it’s painfully clear you lack experience in relationships. I am not a bitter Minmei fan. I don’t care about his habits. I don’t need them to see what’s right in front of me. No worries by this very weekend. I am going to show you why I am known as a camp-killer- dream crusher.
You know one of my dearest friends said I am making Sheryl out to be a bitch. I never called her that. For you people to assume it…just means you can see it. Nothing I said was false. You were all so mad but I proved she’s just a liar, shallow and insensitive. If you like her you should accept her for what she is. You shouldn’t assassinate Ranka’s character for the same crap that Sheryl does, because Sheryl fails as a heroine.